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Post by lag123 on Oct 22, 2017 16:38:54 GMT
Rabbi Neil,
Thank you for raising the topic last Friday night, and indeed it is an important as well as timely one and certainly bears further thought and discussion. Within American cultural and social context, (not being that familiar with that in the UK on the issue) it is in my opinion a very complicated, complex issue with many shades of gray. I think trying to adequately define harassment is much more difficult than sexual assault and abuse, not that those are easy definitions in and of themselves. Is sexual harassment only verbal or does it also extend to non-verbal communication? I think it includes both.
We know that on US college campuses, they are really struggling to deal with sexual assault issues and allegations and often times not very successful when it comes to student discipline "hearings." It is further compounded by the current Administration trying to "roll back" progress made in helping students and administrators dealing with these cases.
Accusations of sexual harassment must be exercised carefully because if misstated it can ruin both a man as well as woman's professional as well as personal reputations/lives. Moreover, sexual harassment can and does work in both directions albeit much less so than male to female and shouldn't be overlooked in the broader conversation.
In my professional experience, both in US colleges/universities and Federal Gov't., they struggle mightily to provide adequate as well as meaning programs to educate and sensitize people to the issue. On many occasions, we were required to attend "training" sessions, which in principle, is a good idea but fell woefully short of being effective much less tolerable to sit through.
Like you, do I have any immediate answers or solutions? No, I don't, but we need to be aware because there's often no 'black and white' clarity when it comes to defining sexual harassment much less how it is dealt with. I appreciate your letting us share our thoughts/comments.
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Post by Rabbi Neil on Oct 29, 2017 3:28:11 GMT
Thank you. I am so very sorry that I do not have a copy of this sermon to post. A technical error and handing out the hard copy to someone who asked means that I no longer have a copy of the sermon. But it is the start of a conversation that is developing over the weeks.
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Jennifer S. Elliott
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Post by Jennifer S. Elliott on Jan 17, 2018 21:04:08 GMT
Perhaps a copy of the sermon can be found in the Temple Beth Shalom Stream Spot archives.
Thanks for addressing the topic.
When I was in elementary school here in Santa Fe at Atalaya Elementary School (my snail mail address always has been 1211 Calle Luna, Santa Fe, NM, 87501-8911, my whole life), I was either entering or exiting the school bus, when a fellow student informed me that the song playing on the radio, "stop in the name of love before you break my heart" was by Sting and the Police. I don't know that I would accuse the student of having intentionally lied to me, but I do now know that Sting and the Police did not write that song.
At the time, I did not know whether the student was lying to me. I pondered the idea that the statement, "Stop in the name of love before you break my heart; think it over" was associated in the mind of a child with a sting and the police.
I wondered why this comment was directed at me.
At the time, I was in love with a boy named Jerrad. It was no secret at school. Jerrad admitted to being my friend but was very cruel to me sometimes. I persisted from second grade into part of fourth grade in being as kind and loving towards him as possible, no matter how cruel he was to me.
In fourth grade, I finally reached my last shred of dignity, and in order to preserve it, I finally ignored Jerrad. Instantly, when I did that, Jerrad went from being the most popular kid in the whole school to being an outcast, and quickly, his mom had him transferred over to EJ Martinez. I have been in touch with him since then, but not since my mom died about five years ago.
In any case, the comment about Sting and the Police was made when I still was pursuing Jerrad, before I finally ignored him in fourth grade.
I wondered if I was being given a coded message to stop pursuing Jerrad. I thought that I might be seen as being obsessed with him, as being a stalker and a harasser of him. Sometimes he avoided me, and I didn't stop pursuing him. However, I felt I was not a stalker or harasser because I had no criminal intent or intent to harm him.
Still, I wondered. I found out that Sting and the Police wrote a so-called stalker song. I listened to it, and it sounded to me like it was either talking about G-d or about my mom.
Do you think G-d is a stalker or a harasser?
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Post by Rabbi Neil on Jan 18, 2018 16:03:39 GMT
No, I absolutely do not think that God is a stalker or harasser, although I do understand the early Rabbinic perception of God as someone who watches our every move is intrusive in the extreme, if one takes God to be a supernatural Being who watches.
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Post by sftbsreader on Jan 27, 2018 19:55:25 GMT
Dear Jennifer
I hope you can be kind to your 2nd-4th grade self as I only see your "problem" from the authenticity of a little girl who was honest with her feelings and those are not diminished because you were a child. And as we know kids can be cruel to one another and emotional feelings and interactions do begin at a very young age. Your feelings were unrequited and Jarred obviously didn't have a clue what do so he was pushing you away. It doesn't seem that you did anything out of the ordinary of childhood crushes. I had a couple major ones and piled on the adult ones and marriage and divorce and the whole gamut. If you figure out how to navigate same successfully at any age you will be ahead of most (including myself).
Also I do think that on occasion we do revisit the childhood lens to examine how we deal with things - I don't live in the past but I am also aware past experiences form who I am and how I sometimes respond to people and events that happen in my life. I like to think I have learned and can make better decisions and as Viktor Frankl so eloquently put it, exercise that last freedom which is to choose how to respond to what happens to me.
I agree the societal conversation we are having now is good - and imperfect and messy and not always fair or just - but necessary. I am also pleased that while some women disagree, many men want to be part of the conversation. I welcome men who want to explore and learn and make amends if they need to or change their own behavior if they have transgressed in the past even on the milder end of the spectrum. Men are part of the same culture of patriarchy that abuse of women comes from. But we don't need to destroy men as we dismantle the patriarchy.
This conversation is going to go on for a long time and my hope is that the Jennifers and Jarreds in elementary school today will grow up in a more just world. We have to keep working at it, all the time. As a closing note - a boy in my school had a huge crush on me in 7th grade and I didn't like him at all. I think I was not very kind to him - we became friends in high school and he had a girlfriend by then so the hormones did not get in the way of our friendship. We had many common interests and many classes together. I have always done better with friendships than love - and I never did fall in love with this man which has made him my longest time friend of my entire life and we are no longer young. We always stayed in touch and in my 20s I brought up what happened in 7th grade and we had an incredible conversation about all of it and what makes people who they are. We have remained friends through our various marriages and divorces and life experiences and losses of our parents who were about the same age. He is an only and always wanted a sibling. I have a difficult sibling and tell him he was lucky to be an only. We share so much and I adore his now long-time second wife. Friendship is really the basis for a good relationship - and maybe that should be where we start when it comes to all these issues MeToo and TimesUp are grappling with. Then we can start on an equal footing and see each other as humans first.
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